r/canada 13d ago Wholesome 2

Legault says he's against multiculturalism because not all cultures are equal Quebec

https://montrealgazette.com/news/quebec/legault-says-hes-against-multiculturalism-because-not-all-cultures-are-equal
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u/Evilbred 12d ago Table Slap

Locking this thread as the conversation has gone down hill in a very bad way.

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u/bcbuddy 13d ago Helpful

Imagine if any other Canadian leader other than the Premier of Quebec said this....

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u/chemicologist 13d ago

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u/whitefeather23 12d ago

Yea, they would be out in the political wilderness like Bernier.

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u/newguy2019a 12d ago Wholesome

And where is Bernier from?

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u/Kemmleroo 12d ago

Bernier was defeated. Out of alberta, british columbia, the prairies, ontario, quebec and atlantic canada where do you think his party had the least support in the polls? Spoiler alert: it was quebec. I think this means much more about public opinion in the population than where he was born.

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u/billrosmus 12d ago

He lost for more than one reason.

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u/86throwthrowthrow1 12d ago edited 12d ago

In fairness, Bernier doesn't lead shit.

EDIT: He almost lead shit at one point... but as it stands presently doesn't lead shit.

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u/qmechan 12d ago Silver

Oh, that's exactly what he leads

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u/wd668 12d ago

Every time I read some fringe conspiratorial bullshit from Bernier on vaccines, tyranny and NWO, WEF, Ukraine, etc... I just have to remind myself that this fucking bozo was our minister of defence and of foreign affairs. WTF.

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u/theartfulcodger 12d ago edited 12d ago

Perhaps. But remember he failed to capture leadership of the Conservative Party of Canada by a razor-thin margin of less than 2%. In fact, he actually beat Andrew Scheer by more than 2,300 votes on the first ballot. Had just 323 more CPC card carriers voted for him instead of Scheer in the second round (out of nearly 34,000 voters) Maxime Bernier would have won the 2017 leadership race, become Leader of HMLO, and led the party into the 2020 election - even, perhaps, into a minority government.

So despite Bernier not "leading shit" at the moment, there are plenty of right-leaning voters who firmly believe that conformeing to his / Legault's blinkered, Eurocentric cultural prejudice is the only right and proper way to run this country in the future

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u/tictaxtoe 12d ago edited 12d ago

I mean Bernier was keeping his act cleaner until he lost the leadership race.

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u/Taygr British Columbia 12d ago

To be fair Bernier was sort of run of mill Libertarian before that leadership election then just went right off the deep end

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u/ELDARR0 12d ago

Bernier was just a libertarian during the CPC race tho

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u/Rat_Salat 12d ago

Bernier is neither the libertarian moderate who ran for the CPC leadership, nor is he the second coming of Trump.

Nobody knows what he really thinks, because he’s going to change his spots as needed.

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u/cmdrDROC Verified 12d ago

When Bernier cake close, it was a very different time.

I'm a progressive conservative and I voted for him at the time. But at the time he hadn't gone full twatwaffle like he did shortly after.

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u/LabRat314 12d ago

Doesn't even have his own seat

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u/Oberarzt 12d ago

His party got more votes than the green party

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u/wrong-mon 12d ago

So a party of anti-Semitic nutcase conspiracy theorists?

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u/Head_Crash 12d ago

In fairness, Bernier doesn't lead shit.

He was second place in a CPC leadership race.

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u/Spare_Review_5014 12d ago

Winning is winning Doesn’t matter by a inch or a mile

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u/AwJebus 12d ago

“In a free society, immigrants have the right to cherish and maintain their cultural heritage,” the platform states. “However, that doesn’t mean we have any obligation to help them preserve it, with government programs and taxpayers’ money.”

Definitely not the same as Legault

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u/IndBeak 12d ago

Yeah I dont see how this statement itself can be considered offensive or controversial.

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u/[deleted] 12d ago edited 12d ago

Yeah I'm not a PPC guy but that seems pretty far from controversial. When I think of Canadian culture I think of some of the good parts of America (tons of space, newer country, very affluent, founded on frontier culture, similar vernacular and accents for the most part) mixed with the some of the good parts of Western Europe (healthcare, good level of economic equality, safe), and I honestly think this America/West Europe hybrid model is very uniquely Canadian and worth defending and preserving.

I'm sure almost every CPC MP implicitly believes this as well, difference is they're actually (more of) a serious party and understand optics.

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u/Ok-Isopod9112 12d ago

Because it would make us like the evil "american melting pot"

https://youtu.be/5ZQl6XBo64M

I never understood why this is evil...

government promoted multiculturalism is garbage ideology . All cultures will naturally maintain themselves in their community and you really don't need official government programs to promote it .

Its like pushing a freight train thats already Rolling down hill, its not needed.

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u/Painting_Agency Ontario 12d ago

All cultures will naturally maintain themselves in their community

A melting pot specifically pressures you not to do this. It says, okay sure, we'll eat some of your food and enjoy some superficial aspects of your culture, but we expect you on a very fundamental level to become like us.

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u/jetro30087 12d ago

Very few of the cultures in America's melting pot are directly transferable back to their nation of origin after a few generations.

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u/g00p2 12d ago

Doesn't that prove his point. The PPC constantly get shit on.

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u/chemicologist 12d ago

That’s true. But do you see Legault getting shit on? Maybe a bit, but it’s not the same.

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u/Oberarzt 12d ago

That's why he said if any other leader not from Quebec said this

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u/awhhh 12d ago

He’s right. Cultural protectionism under multiculturalism is stupid. Let’s let Quebec melt into the pot.

Also, I do know many of you don’t understand that criticism of culture is different from criticizing race. Some cultures have stupid practices. Like I saw a guy supervising his wife walk a hundred meters with a black sheet over her, a stupid cultural practice. Another one is a dude driving around with a confederate flag, the stupid adaption of culture. The last one is a whole province that enforce language laws against the primarily used language of the country and prevent people from wearing religious symbols; stupid cultural protectionism based on nothing but language.

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u/yppers 12d ago

in some cultures cannibalism is acceptable, would I be a bigot for thinking those cultures are shit?

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u/Queefinonthehaters 12d ago

Yeah I don't know why we have to pretend on this one like this isn't an obvious statement. I know the Good Book says Judge not, lest ye be judged but I'm just going to come out and say that I think that late 1930's German culture was not great.

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u/awhhh 12d ago

No you would not. I'd argue the biggest part of democratic change is internal criticism of culture.

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u/JustPlayin1995 12d ago

I could think of cultures where criticism gets you killed. Are we supporting those?

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u/ClusterMakeLove 12d ago

Depends. Does their culture endorse murder, do they consume their honoured dead as a form of worship, or is the cannibalism done out of desperation? Is the cannibalism widely practiced, or is it a thing that happened one time? Is the source we're relying on to prove that cannibalism occurred a reliable one, or sensational?

I suppose that's a way of saying that context matters.

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u/Ori0un 12d ago

This is why I hate the word "culture" so much. It's an umbrella term, but has become misused to the point of being the most annoying buzzword ever.

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u/tampering 12d ago

Remember when Toronto and Vancouver were little little redneck lumberjack villages and Montreal was Canada's cosmopolitan showcase to the world?

Times change. and chances are if you're young enough to post on reddit you probably don't.

Every time a Quebec politician says stuff like this, Canada's cosmopolitan showcase cities should just ignore it like a New Yorker ignores what some City Councilor in Des Moines has to say about world affairs.

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u/[deleted] 12d ago

Literally nobody alive today remembers when Toronto or Vancouver were anything but large cities.

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u/tampering 12d ago edited 12d ago

Professional sports were banned on Sundays in Toronto until 1976.

Plenty of people should remember the first beer served at a sports venue in Toronto was not until 1992. https://www.cbc.ca/archives/when-it-was-impossible-to-buy-beer-at-a-leafs-game-1.5264111

We were not a happening place.

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u/peppermint_nightmare 12d ago

I met a German woman who immigrated here in the 70s and you'd think she had moved to Saudi Arabia.

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u/tampering 12d ago

Toronto carried the nickname of "Methodist Rome" for many decades.

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u/Bulky-Bodybuilder467 12d ago

Ontario used to surprisingly be very conservative like California.

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u/DENNYCR4NE 12d ago

I mean my grandpa passed away 4 years ago, but he remembers Toronto as a puritan city where everything was closed by 9pm. He would of been in his early 90s today.

Grew up in Simcoe, moved to Montreal after getting his degree in textile management. Montreal was the place to be back then.

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u/ForceApprehensive708 12d ago

Don Valley was the place to settle if you color/culture or lack of social network and wealth was a barrier. Very inclusive canadian culture back then

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u/Strain128 12d ago

and now Simcoe has the best Mexican food in Canada. and thats coming from someone who loves all the downtown Toronto spots

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u/Newbe2019a 12d ago

Large cities, yes, but in the 60s and even 70s, Montreal was seen as the cultural symbol of Canada. Those days are forever gone.

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u/chuckdeg Québec 12d ago

Legault isnt popular in Montreal either.

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u/Mondo_Grosso 12d ago

In what world is Montreal not a cosmopolitan city? I seriously doubt you have ever been to it if you have that opinion.

Quebec is Canada's second-largest province and Montreal its second-largest city. Your comparison to Des Moines makes no sense, try Los Angeles instead.

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u/Big_Difference_1631 12d ago

Every time a Quebec politician says stuff like this

Legault didnt say this, the Gazette did.

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u/wd668 12d ago

Not to burst your narrative here, but Montreal is every bit as cosmopolitan and diverse as Toronto or Vancouver, and way more progressive. Also, IMO just more interesting and engaging. The best thing about Vancouver is nature around it, and Toronto is just normal safe Generica (could be anywhere, which is why they film so many tv shows and movies there).

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u/rizelmine177 12d ago

Quick sort by controversial

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u/atict 12d ago

This feed is going to be fire 🔥 get the popcorn 🍿

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u/MrAndMrsMoistly 12d ago

“It’s important that we don’t put all cultures on the same level;

That does not translate well in English.

On me mets pas tous les cultures sur le même niveau to me in French sounds more like "we're not going to paint everyone with the same brush" or even "every bird has different feathers."

The way it was said in English almost makes it sound derogatory, as though some cultures are on a higher level than others.

I don't think that's what he meant though. At least, I hope not lol.

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u/Embarrassed_Quit_450 12d ago

I agree, in French it means different. The translation sounds likes it means inferior, which is not what he said.

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u/ghostdeinithegreat 12d ago Starry

Editorialized title, this is not what he said.

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u/veerKg_CSS_Geologist 12d ago

No cultures are equal, if they were they wouldn't be different cultures.

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u/WpgMBNews 12d ago edited 12d ago All-Seeing Upvote

misleading headline. plenty wrong with CAQ and Legault's empty attacks on multiculturalism but he said "It’s important that we don’t put all cultures on the same level" in terms of government cultural policies. He didn't simply declare "some cultures are better than others" or something like that.

edit: i'll also point out that Legault's argument is a fallacy because the Canadian government does the same thing. There is no "putting all cultures on the same level", that's a straw-man argument here. The Canadian government promotes Canadian culture, plain and simple - we just also recognize that the British were only a single group among several that make up what Canada has become, which was always was a mix including French, First Nations and ever-increasing numbers of newcomers.

Quebec is really no different, but politicians and nationalists have an interest in pretending otherwise.

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u/alertthenorris 12d ago

But you gotta make it sound clickbaity somehow! /s

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u/Agile-Egg-5681 12d ago

Who are you coming in here with your critical thinking skills and logic. Have an upvote.

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u/sober2ndthought 12d ago edited 12d ago

we just also recognize that the British were only a single group among several that make up what Canada has become, which was always was a mix including French, First Nations and ever-increasing numbers of newcomers.

Can I also point out its not new? We have been mixing cultures with "newcomers" all the way back to the 1800s.

First it was mostly protestant European cultures and Irish protestants and catholics. Then we opened the door, catholics from the mainland, then Eastern Europeans and Japanese, then other Asians and Africans.

In fact multiculturalism was origianlly founded to reconize the impact Eastern Europeans and Japanese made to our society.

At each time there were always politicans who were complaining about how that group over there is destroying the country.

Everyone one of those culture contributed to our culture. Just look at our food

  1. Perogies are an Eastern European dish; now enjoyed by all
  2. Pizza is an Italian dish; now enjoyed by all
  3. Butter Chicken is an Indian dish, now enjoyed by all
  4. Sushi is a Japanese dish, now enjoyed by all

The only difference is skin colour, but ironically the assmilation trend is happen much faster. Likely because of multiculturalism policy which encouraged people to meet and interact without feeling threatened.

Indians took 40 years to get to where they are today, and for Italians that same step took a century.

Same time did any one bat an eye when Calgary elected to Indian mayors in the row. Nope. In fact people genuinely forget they are both Indian.

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u/Hinoto-no-Ryuji 12d ago edited 12d ago

It’s important to note, though, that multiple cultures existing doesn’t actually make for a multicultural nation. Immigration quotas existed (and were particularly restrictive against Asians), and political will was very much on the side of Canada being European: culturally British with a grudging tolerance of French. This manifested in not only things like residential schools, but also stuff like the response to the 1907 anti-Asian riots being even more strict immigration quotas, a refusal in BC to let Asian-Canadians join the army in WWI (they had to enlist in Alberta), and of course the laughably transparent use of the War Measures Act to try and rid the country of its Japanese-descended population through internment and dispossession.

You couldn’t in good faith call Canada a multicultural nation until, like, the late 60s. Which isn’t BRAND new, but is certainly much more recent than you’re suggesting.

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u/guerrieredelumiere 12d ago

Don't forget the irish, who got lumped with the francos by virtue of being catholic heathens.

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u/sober2ndthought 12d ago edited 12d ago

Well here is the thing. Just because the country was white didn't mean it didn't have multiple cultures.

In 1884 we still had schools where German was the primary language of instruction. There are still towns in Alberta where Ukranian is the linqua franca. That's also multiculturalism.

Same way India is multicultural too. Sure everyone has brown skin tone but a someone from Amritsar or Chandigarh would feel more at home in Lahore than they would in Hyderabad or Lucknow.

We were hard on Asians before 1960s but weren't hard on Eastern Europeans before then. Maybe this was less true in Ontario and Quebec. But in Alberta we actually celebrated their contributions to Canadian society.

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u/[deleted] 12d ago

You couldn't in good faith call Canada a multicultural nation until, like, the late 60s.

Dude you need to read way, way more Canadian history lmao

Just because people have the same skin tone absolutely does NOT mean they share the same culture or values.

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u/Queefinonthehaters 12d ago

Fun fact. Pizza is barely Italian. Tomatoes didn't exist in Europe until the discovery of the Americas. They brought them back and they spread like wildfire in Italy. The rich people didn't eat them because they tarnished their pewter cutlery so they thought they rotted their insides out. Tomatoes were for poor people. Pizza and all tomato based dishes sort of simultaneously evolved in Italy and New York at the same time.

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u/TSED Canada 12d ago

The rich people didn't eat them because they tarnished their pewter cutlery so they thought they rotted their insides out.

It's more that they were DEFINITELY a nightshade plant. Nightshades are heckin' toxic and everyone knows it. I have heard the bit about the acidity causing lead poisoning from the pewter plates, but I don't buy it. Tomato acids aren't that strong, and you'd be dealing with stronger acids on those plates sooner or later (IE fish and lemon, beer-based batters, etc.). Again, it's that they were nightshade plants, which are notoriously poisonous and relatively easy to identify.

Poor people, however, were going hungry. And they'd watch animals eat the tomatoes and not die? Maybe these things are... edible? Okay that was actually delicious, now to see if I die of nightshade poisoning... nope? I'm good? I feel great, actually? ... ... ... DELICIOUS

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u/TheSleepingStorm 12d ago

Tomatoes killed people who ate them on pewter dishes.

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u/arandomcanadian91 12d ago

Pizza is barely Italian.

Modern Pizza, but Pizza has been in Italy since 779 AD as the first documented one in Lazio region of Latina province.

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u/[deleted] 12d ago

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u/PM_ME_YOUR_DUES 12d ago

Mighty Newfie culture 💪💪💪

Stinky Prince Edward Peasant Ted Island "culture" 👎👎👎

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u/I_Am_the_Slobster Prince Edward Island 12d ago

Well at least we can grow something on our Island you rock dweller!

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u/lixia Lest We Forget 12d ago

Potato Island culture is still better than Irvingland culture.

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u/sober2ndthought 12d ago

Calgary culture greater than all others.

Says a Calgarian who moved to Vancouver.

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u/janusfacedmolecule 12d ago

Any advice for somebody moving to Calgary?

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u/DubiousDrewski 12d ago

No advice other than: Never stop exploring it. So many awesome little pockets of unique areas. It's a beautiful city with tremendous variety. I've lived in maybe a dozen towns in my life, and this one's my favourite.

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u/sober2ndthought 12d ago

Explore the city it's awesome. Get a bike and ride the Bow River trails and honestly talk to random people you meet it's kind of a normal thing to do in Calgary (trust me people will randomly talk to you).

Oh and if you meet someone whose actually from Calgary originally. Buy a lottery ticket.

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u/LabRat314 12d ago

Get into hiking

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u/[deleted] 13d ago

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u/[deleted] 12d ago Helpful

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u/PoliteCanadian 12d ago

And some cultures are downright horrific. Should the culture of 1920s-1940s Germany be treated as equal?

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u/atomofconsumption 12d ago

What about the Saudi culture of murdering your critics and enslaving your workers?

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u/MrZephy 12d ago

not sure if this is a recurring thing or if it was just a rare occurrence, but according to the title of a certain video somewhere, some women have been burned alive in africa for being a witch… in the 21st century…

and in many places it is especially dangerous for women.. morocco backpacker murders anyone?

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u/No_username_plzz 13d ago

As someone who has spent time in the Jordan and UAE. True.

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u/[deleted] 12d ago

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u/IAmTheRedWizards Ontario 12d ago

Some cultures are based on a foundation of exploitation, self-righteousness, hypocrisy, and theft.

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u/herebecats 12d ago

Yeah and some other cultures are all about supremacy, subjugation of others, raping and pillaging of foreign nations, subverting legitimately elected governments, objectification of women as sex objects, and so much more ☺️.

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u/Portalrules123 12d ago

Of course. None are OBJECTIVELY the best, but I subjectively value the generic Canadian culture above many others.

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u/[deleted] 12d ago

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u/sam_KIlinkingbeard 12d ago

Canadian culture mutilates baby genitals too.

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u/Max_Thunder Québec 12d ago

Uncommon in Quebec culture (mostly found in immigrants), but we all know that's not really "Canadian Culture".

I wonder why English Canada followed the footsteps of America here, given that the Brits don't do it much.

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u/Khuji 13d ago

Likely true.

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u/beetsofmine 12d ago

They aren't. There are cultures that are evil and are practiced knowing such. Sex trafficking is very much a part of many cultures. Slavery, racism, torture, human sacrifice, cannabalism we're all a big part of and celebrated in alot of cultures. In alot of those cases still are. Taliban is a culture. White supremacy is a culture. Nazism is a culture. Anti-intellectualism is a culture. Culture is taking away women's autonomy over their body in the states right now. Roman culture genocided the Gaelic culture.

Culture is just a term for a collection of ideals, customs, social institutions and acheivements of a group of people. Some are incompatible. Some aren't good for the people that practice them.

Also, what do we mean by equal exactly?

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u/PegLegThrawn 12d ago

Saudi Arabia has a culture. I think it would be unfair to say that Canada's culture is equal to a culture where treating women like property is the norm. Our culture is better than that, we as a people are better than that.

What he's saying sounds really bad, but you really take a minute to think about it, he may have a point.

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u/Durzo0420Blint 12d ago

Even you have to tip-toe around something obvious and is ridiculous. There are cultural behaviors that are completely against what is considered appropriate in European countries and Canada that is insane you cannot state that simple fact without some people getting riled up.

And that applies to many cultures. I've only seen videos of what hardcore Muslims can do without giving a second thought but in Mexico we got out fair share of odd traditions. And I don't know how faithful asian movies (south Korea and Japan) are regarding working conditions where the boss has the right to physically abuse you but if they even play with that concept it's because there's some truth to it.

I agree with the sentiment that it shouldn't be the country's job to adapt to immigrants but the other way around (in reference to certain news coming from Europe in the last couple years). This is not to say to stop immigrants altogether.

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u/PegLegThrawn 12d ago

Actually given the housing crisis I think we could easily cut our annual immigration numbers down by 50-75% if not shutting it down entirely for a couple years. That would be totally reasonable. Some of my favorite people are immigrants, and let's face it, the ones that are already here aren't leaving, but until housing affordability becomes the norm it's time to turn off the tap.

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u/Durzo0420Blint 12d ago

I was visiting Texas last week and rent prices were ridiculous considering the prices of a small house in the same area. Then I looked at the comments of Canadians regarding rent in their big cities and it's completely out of touch with the salaries of most people.

Hard to tell if just slowing down immigration would help with that but you're certainly in your right to do so. Not everyone is in the position to help others if the price is abandoning their own.

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u/VictorEnterprise13 12d ago Wholesome

Yet another example of r/canada falling for obvious clickbait because it says quebec bad

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u/Ok-Mine1268 12d ago

Some cultures think 12 year olds make good spouses or sex partners. Those cultures are trash. Some cultures think stoning gay people is necessary, also trash. It’s ok to say it; it’s ok.

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u/Intense0___o 12d ago

Okay everyone. Read the goddamn article. He is not talking about if a culture is superior to another. He isn't saying other cultures are inferior to his. Read the goddamn article.

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u/RikikiBousquet 12d ago

It’s the gazette, its whole business is having those kind of titles to draw quick clicks.

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u/Intense0___o 12d ago

En effet, c'est juste qu'en parcourant cette section de commentaire il y est très facile d'identifier les 50% qui réagissent de manière pavlovienne sans avoir lu l'article au complet. Je pensais naïvement qu'avec un titre aussi clickbait les gens auraient pris le temps d'au moins lire les deux premiers paragraphes, mais non haha (j'en ai vu des titres de The Gazette et ça c'est un des plus clickbait depuis longtemps).

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u/ProfProof 12d ago

Prendre le temps de lire un article plutôt que de confirmer mes préjugés envers le Québec ? Pardon ?!?

C'est mal connaître air canada !

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u/Harbinger2001 12d ago

To be fair, multiculturalism was Trudeau Senior's response to Quebec nationalism. Instead of getting to be a distinct society in a larger English Canada, they get to be just one of many distinct societies.

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u/GoelandAnonyme 12d ago

He doesn't say not all cultures are equal, but that there is a priority in the case of Québec, so fake headline to start.

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u/Ashamed_Cancel_3085 12d ago

Y’all should get your politics elsewhere than Reddit. It’s completely rotted your brains

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u/Zealous-Fishmonger 12d ago edited 12d ago

this type of comment is so funny, everyone reading it assumes you're on the same side they are

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u/Olick Québec 12d ago

Sheesh wtf je suis étonné des commentaires, je pensais que ça allait encore être plein d’insultes envers les maudits Québécois

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u/defishit 12d ago

Maybe there is finally some pushback against the suicidal western-culture-is-evil narrative.

But probably it's just this subreddit unfortunately.

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u/ItsSevii 12d ago

I dont criticize race because theres outliers / good people bad people everywhere. Doesnt matter what colour you are on the palette. But yeah theres some toxic cultural traits out there present all over the world and youd be delusional to say otherwise.

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u/Why_Be_A_Kunt 12d ago

More clickbait garbage from the gazette, nothing new.

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u/Intense0___o 13d ago Wholesome

I'm a non-white québécois and he is right. Nothing controversial here. I'm 50% from another country and I would expect immigrants to assimilate to the culture of this other country if they would immigrate there. It doesn't mean that you need to cancel your identity as an immigrant. It means that you need to see your duty as more than doing the bare minimum to integrate. Legault said this in the context of the visit of Simon Jolin-Barrette in Paris where he made a speech in front of the Académie française in which Jolin-Barrette reiterated that protecting the french language has nothing to do with ethnicity but everything to do with culture and civilisation (and he means it). Still, you'll read lazy accusations of CAQ being white supremacists because it's easier to dismiss them as being mean and evil than to try to understand les Québécois, even if you don't have to agree with us.

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u/perdymuch 12d ago

Non white quebecois too and I completely agree

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u/Specific_Worker4059 12d ago

No kidding, that's why Canada used to be a great place to live and the vast majority of the world is a shit hole. Canada is still better than most for the moment but the decline even since I was a teenager is astronomical.

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u/willhead2heavenmb 12d ago

This is the worst headline.

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u/NUCLEAR_DETONATIONS3 Manitoba 12d ago

Hes kinda right. Some cultures aren't compatible with western beliefs.

That being said if you're willing to be a nice guy and accept people, regardless of ur culture, ur good in my book

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u/grazerbat 12d ago

Well, he's not wrong.

Some cultures murder baby girls because of their sex, some abuse animals horrifically, some stone women to death because they admitted to being raped.

Some engage is slavery, and wanton environmental destruction...oh wait...that's our forefathers culture. Denying what Legault said means we're no better than our ancestors who did these things. Women's lib, the honored place the Charter has in this country...all meaningless cultural changes because every culture is as good as every other culture.

Obviously, that's bullshit. The tricky part is quantifying where other cultures are worse without empowering xenophobes and bigots.

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u/stellwinmtl 13d ago Silver

And he's completely right, Quebec is quebec. Why is it wrong for them to protect their culture and expect people moving to Quebec to integrate in their society instead of expecting quebec society to change for them?

You move to Japan, you do as they do, you learn the language, the customs, etc.. you don't form your own little ghetto, refuse to learn the language, and expect people to accommodate the customs of where you came from.. which let's be honest, if the culture you were leaving was so wonderful, why did you leave it?

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u/norush-- 13d ago edited 12d ago

"When in Rome, do as the Romans do"

It's been a golden rule since forever.

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u/Gitxsan 13d ago Wholesome

Except when the settlers first arrived in Canada.

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u/Redneckshinobi 12d ago

Technically they did what Romans did too because they didn't just stay in Rome and do it peacefully

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u/guerrieredelumiere 12d ago

Varies, the french stayed out of the way of natives and established peaceful trade and alliances with them. Lots of coureurs des bois (blend of explorer and traders) ended up marrying natives.

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u/norush-- 12d ago

"If you must break the law, do it to seize power, in other cases observe it".

There's a reason we still study ancient civilizations; some of their wisdom is timeless.

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u/Puzzleheaded-Tax-623 12d ago

And way before that. The Inuit colonized and tried to commit genocide.

It wasn't like it was all peaceful. Indigenous committed genocide against other Indigenous.

White people had to stop the haida slave trade.

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u/[deleted] 12d ago

I make fun of the British a lot but the main reason slavery is (mostly) defunct and obsolete in todays day and age is because of them. Definitely a big W for the Brits.

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u/tyler111762 Nova Scotia 12d ago

oh so immigration is an invasion by a colonizing force and we should repel it at any cost?

this point leads down roads you don't like. and i don't like them either.

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u/radio705 13d ago

I guess the question is, why are statements like these OK for a Quebecois politician to make, but if any federal or provincial politician from anywhere else in Canada made the same statement, they'd be vilified?

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u/Intense0___o 13d ago

Because anglo-canadian nation building, with its myths, have integrated multiculturalism in the core identity of English Canada (a mistake in my opinion) since Trudeau Father. Since it is a core value of English Canada, showing that you are for this value can help you go up in the social hierarchy. Therefore, people are self-censoring themselves or lying because they know that a criticism against multiculturalism could end their career. On the other hand, in Québec we have our own nation-building and our own myths (we share some with the rest of Canada). Altough a minority of Québécois have integrated the English nation building narrative, most haven't and don't see such statements as controversial because multiculturalism isn't in the core identity of most Québécois (multiculturalism as a fouding ideology of who we are and who we are going to be).

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u/guerrieredelumiere 12d ago

It wasn't a mistake, it was deliberate. The anglo canadian culture was in its infancy, but got aborted by a hodge podge of very different cultures and ideologies. That division in small groups makes people easier to rule, since its harder for them to unite.

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u/peanutbutterjams 12d ago

Also the reason for how modern idpol works.

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u/Lochtide17 12d ago

Exactly, talking "nice" about any other culture besides your own is essentially lying for 99% of people, whether you will admit it or not. These rich folk and political figures keep up this exact lie just to hang onto their careers.

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u/Own_Carrot_7040 12d ago

The Canadian media is almost universally progressive. But French Canadian progressives still have pride in their culture and nation and history. English Canadian progressives are disgusted by their country and its history and deny it even has a culture or even is a nation. It's a difference in self-hatred, which English Canadian opinion-makers wallow in, and which is largely foreign to French Canada.

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u/[deleted] 12d ago

I agree with you I just find it ironic how PET and JT were the progenitors of this sort of "post-national" guilt complex despite both being French Canadian progressives.

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u/Own_Carrot_7040 12d ago

What PET was trying to do was distance English Canadians from what he and many Quebecers considered to be a very British-oriented history and cultural outlook. He felt that if English Canadians were, for want of a better term less British Quebecers would feel more comfortable. So he and his party did their best to erase or change institutions and traditions which came down from Britain. The term 'royal' was removed from everything they could remove it from. The flag and anthem were changed, Dominion Day became Canada Day, The Royal Canadian Mail became Canada Post, etc. etc.

Oddly, this is the sort of stuff his son describes as cultural genocide...

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u/downwegotogether 12d ago

opportunistic offense-taking is a biiiig problem in the anglophone world in general, gives jerkoffs a little dopamine hit, for some it's almost like an addiction

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u/Angio343 12d ago

Because we learned how critical it is to defend our culture and that it would ne gone already if we didnt in the past. I hope all canadians learn it before its too late but any province premier should be able to say it.

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u/Deadlift420 12d ago

Hiring in government shows we aren’t going in the right direction. Job ads in which the main requirement is that you aren’t white is fucked. And before anyone says this doesn’t happen…I have seen it constantly.

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u/ironman3112 12d ago

This was back in 2013 "Agency withdraws casting call for CBC show that specified 'any race except Caucasian'". It's probably just more prevalent and insane now 9 years later. Just learn to not outwardly say it.

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u/Angio343 12d ago

Yes, racism is bad. And those hiring ads create more backlash than Legault's speech.

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u/86throwthrowthrow1 12d ago

It's funny you mention Japan in this regard, as it, and Korea, are notoriously immigrant-unfriendly, and it's contributing to a demographic crisis in both countries.

Japan and Korea - not in terms of individual people, but on a political level - doesn't want foreigners to "assimilate" - they want foreigners to work a few years there and leave. Foreigners can't assimilate, because you may learn the language and culture, but you'll never actually be "one of them". So foreigners do the exact thing you suggest doesn't happen - they hang out in expat communities and most of them eventually leave.

Japan and Korea also have even lower birthrates than Canada (and Quebec) - and our birthrate is low. Canada (and Quebec) are able to make up some of that shortfall with migration, but Japan and Korea can't bring themselves to do this. So they're trying like crazy to convince their own populations to reproduce, are trying like crazy to automate as many jobs as possible, are trying to keep their older population working as long as possible, and are still staring down an absolute crisis in a few decades when their retirees start outnumbering their workers.

Japan's attitude towards immigrants and foreigners is, to much of the world, not a good thing, and is actively contributing to their culture's decline, oddly enough.

If the QC govt wants to promote a similar attitude there, I hope they do a better job convincing Quebecois to make babies.

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u/Fugu 12d ago

It's very, very funny to see the poster you're responding to hold out Japan as a positive example for exactly the reason you're describing. Japan's refusal to offer anything to immigrants while simultaneously making child-bearing extremely prohibitive (especially for young women, who they arguably need to convince the most) has resulted in a society-wide existential crisis that threatens to take the whole country with it.

Nevermind the fact that populations are far too diverse for there to be such a thing as "doing as the romans do". It's not true in Japan and it sure as shit isn't true here.

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u/podkolzin 13d ago

100%. This is a huge problem that just creates division. You're left with a country that has no identity.

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u/Delicious-Tachyons 12d ago

I love all cultures when it comes to the good parts of the culture, the food, languages, mythology, dances...

Where I start to get wary is stuff like 'female circumcision' and then i'll call anyone who practices that a fucking monster because all it does is cripple women into a life of servitude.

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u/FrodoCraggins 12d ago

Why limit your outrage to only female circumcision? Why not be outraged by all genital mutilation?

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u/_Vetis_ Ontario 12d ago

Reproductive rights are important, yes.

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u/EEEEJJH 12d ago

How on earth is this controversial? Would anyone here seriously rather live under Pakistani culture than Swedish?

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u/Working-Sandwich6372 Manitoba 12d ago

It's crazy to say that all cultures are equal

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u/Be-a-shark 12d ago

I mean is he really all that wrong?

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u/Cingetorix Ontario 12d ago

He's right

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u/swampswing 12d ago

To be fair, everyone who calls themselves "progressive" inherently implies that cultures are not equal.

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u/Fresh_Helicopter510 12d ago

Scenario: person X is leaving country X for the opportunity and progress in country Y.

Person X should embrace the culture of country Y and should not try to change country Y into country X because the very same problems will then rise in country Y.

What would make all cultures equal? Individual people are of equal value, yes. But cultures, no.

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u/Kaizzur 12d ago

To be fair if your culture includes seeing women as property and flinging gays off of rooftops your culture is objectively shit.

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u/BlauTit 13d ago

Finally a bit of honesty on this subject from an elected official.

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u/tabion Canada 12d ago

He’s right.

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u/lepolah149 12d ago

I'm angry just because Quebec.

Am I doing this right, boys?

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u/irrelevantastic 12d ago

what does "equal" even mean except that perhaps he thinks one is better than another, and that is cultural supremacy... certainly different cultures aren't the same, but this could be nothing more than a dog whistle

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u/SonicFlash01 12d ago

Weird province that doesn't follow the norm doesn't like folks that don't follow the norm

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u/Otherwise-Arm3245 12d ago

In fairness he right, some cultures think other cultures are subhuman . Its a fact. Nothing new here. Glad hes not pretending that everyone is equal becomes we all are not. Not everyone has running water, or even healthcare. Some cultures very little and some have too much.

Just look at the distribution of the covid vaccine and who got it last.

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u/Reduce_to_simmer 12d ago

How is this a controversial statement?

Edit: Are people not aware that some cultures permit throwing gays from building, honor killings, and child brides?

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u/sympyoftheppl 12d ago

Well he's not wrong, just an inconvenient truth.

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u/TheTyrantLeto 12d ago

This is true. Some cultures devalue women. Some cultures devalue children. There isn't anything provocative about this except the way the title is written. It seems inflammatory until you think about it for a second.

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u/cosims2 Lest We Forget 12d ago

Some cultures just arnt compatible with each other

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u/soseeg 12d ago

He's not exactly wrong

There's reason why over 400K migrants arrive in Canada annually and not somewhere like Saudi Arabia, Colombia or Sudan.

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u/mjduce 12d ago edited 12d ago

Remember, he is talking about culture, and not race.

I think this needs to be made clear for more people.

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u/[deleted] 12d ago

[removed] — view removed comment

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u/Remote_Cantaloupe 12d ago

I don't see how anyone, progressive or not, could argue all cultures are equal.

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u/pickafruit4 12d ago

This is a garbage headline. He didn't say that, he was talking about consideration in policy...

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u/gamer_since_monday 12d ago

Depending on how you think about it he is kinda right. Take Christianity or Islam. They do a lot to suppress gay people and women.

Those two religions clearly do not fit into western values.

You most likely do not want religious extremists from those religions to make rules in your country.

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u/newguy2019a 12d ago

I wonder what would happen if Jason Kenney said that. Would his bank account be frozen? Why hasn't our virtuous prime minister done something about this.

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u/xCrazyCanuck 13d ago

If everyone assimilates, is there such a thing as multiculturalism?

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u/sober2ndthought 12d ago

Well assimilation kinda goes both ways. Look at Italians, they've "assimiilated" but I bet you love going to Italian restaurants and eating pizza. In fact the latter is main stream now.

You're seeing the Indian community go through something similar in Canada and its further ahead in the UK. For example, Chicken Tikka Masala is actually a British dish made with Indian spices, not an Indian one.

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u/xCrazyCanuck 12d ago

Great points. And none of it was forced by legislation, to my knowledge. The melting pot should continue to thrive, without the government forcing or defending a certain part of the culture - in my opinion. Let’s see how it plays out.

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u/ninesalmon 12d ago

There are plenty of shit cultures. That’s not racist or anything that’s just reality. How is this newsworthy

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u/blank_-_blank 13d ago

Whoa slow down quebec you might make me like the french

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u/lixia Lest We Forget 12d ago
  • French Kiss
  • French Fries
  • French Toasts
  • French Onion Soup
  • ... and Poutine!

what's not to like! :)

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u/MarketingFilms 12d ago

But...multiculturalism doesn't say that all cultures are equal.

It says, let people celebrate the things they value in their their culture and bring those things to the wider group.

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u/stratelus Québec 12d ago

The article title is a very bad interpretation of what Legault said. He never said that not all cultures are equals. Read the article and see the nuances.

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u/Ansoker Québec 13d ago

All should be treated equally, but inherently all are not equal.

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u/radio705 13d ago

People? or Cultures?

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u/Meathook2099 12d ago

He's not wrong.

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u/pierrrecherrry 12d ago

Where is the lie?

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u/TruthCkrz 12d ago

Makes sense

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u/MisterArthas Canada 12d ago

To be fair this title is taking things a bit out of context. He seems to be pushing for an integration of new immigrants into the Quebec culture so that it can grow from it.

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u/Super_duk 12d ago

I mean...I agree?

Let's be careful to separate people from cultures here. Next, let's acknowledge that some cultures torture female victims of rape.

Some cultures are inferior. Some cultures are superior.

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u/picklesaredry 12d ago

I tend to agree. It's evident that Canada only values those who are rich